Friday, October 22, 2010

When Sex?. . .. . part 1

Posted: 22 Oct 2010 04:08 AM PDT
GAYTWOGETHERpgtww033109 Introduction - Question: At what point does a dating relationship turn sexual if you’re looking for a lasting relationship?
The reader posing this question goes on to say that in his experience, sex too soon in a dating relationship seemed to make the connection all about sex, while waiting for an extended period of time resulted in men perceiving him as a “tease” or being uninterested in them for anything but just friendship.

So what’s a guy to do? When is the right time to have sex so as not to sabotage the development of a potentially healthy relationship with a compatible dating prospect? Well, the long and the short of it is that there is no right time! There’s no science or magic formula to negotiating the right time to be sexual to guarantee lasting success. There are no guarantees in relationships. What it boils down to is each individual’s readiness and comfort level with taking things to that next step and keeping the channels of communication open.

So while there’s no hardfast rule, this article will offer some tips and questions for reflection for you to decide when the time is right for you to take things to the “bedroom level.” Through this content, perhaps you will discover some factors that might promote the opportunity for success of a long-term relationship that you can integrate into your own dating plan and sexual decision-making practices.

Sex & Gay Dating:
Sex is obviously a very important part of a relationship. In gay dating, sex actually plays a vital developmental role in helping a man to explore his sexuality during the coming-out process and forming his identity as a gay man; it’s a healthy rite-of-passage. Sex plays other roles though in gay culture. Its purpose can be for:

• pure recreational fun
• tension release
• a thrill for conquest
• a rebellion against heterosexist norms
• an uncontrollable addiction
• a way to boost one’s self-esteem
• a mask for emotional problems
• a temporary cure for boredom or loneliness
• horniness gratification
• a vehicle for avoiding emotional intimacy…among others.

For you, as the serious dater seeking Mr. Right, your vision for the primary purpose of sex is as an expression of your feelings of adoration for one another, cementing a bond of closeness and connection as you begin to seal an identity as a couple with the intention of life-long commitment.

Your job is to adequately screen your dating partners to determine if their vision for sexuality and life aligns with yours. It’s when there’s a mismatch between these visions or differing motives from the purposes above that leads to relationships ending before they even got started when sex enters the picture early on.

Knowing Thyself:
Before you even begin your dating adventures, you must have a solid vision in place of what and who you’re looking for. What are your personal requirements, needs, and wants for a life partner and a relationship? What does dating mean to you and what does it look like? What are your sexual values and attitudes? The answers to these questions become your guide for detecting the “right” vs. the “wrong” types of guys you’re seeking.

Sex is so glamorized in our gay culture that the pressure to succumb to its powerful influences can be overwhelming. That’s why you must have a plan in place before you date so you can more readily “stick to your guns” and not be swayed by temptations or other forces. Knowing yourself and your values is key. Your beliefs about the role you want sex to play in your dating life will shape your behavior as such.

Meeting Mr. Wonderful…Now What?
It’s hard work creating your own vision, but then to assess another guy’s vision for compatibility is another feat that’s not easily accomplished in one or two dates. It’s a process. That’s why introducing sex too early into a dating relationship can be sabotaging because the relationship gets defined around sex before a foundation of trust and intimacy has been established.

This isn’t to say that meaningful relationships can’t evolve from a sex-based affiliation, but in a lot of cases premature sex can send the wrong message or tone that then permeates the entire relationship—and it can be irreversible. Not to mention determining your new guy’s sexual values and motives discussed earlier may not be so easily detectable in the early stages of dating.

Most gay dating experts agree that a wise approach for those seeking long-term relationships is to hold off on sex for at least 3-4 dates with a man. This allows time for a friendship to develop, to screen each other to the best you can for “goodness-of-fit”, and lets the relationship be defined around common interests, goals, and mature companionship—enduring qualities that highlight successful relationships.

Sex alone is not sufficient to carry a lasting partnership. You’ll also be able to tell in a lot of cases whether the man is genuinely interested in you or if he’s solely after sex or gratification of other motives. Once you have sex, it changes the dynamics, so it’s important to pace the relationship.
( Part Two - Monday )
© 2006 Brian L. Rzepczynski

Brian Rzepczynski, Certified Personal Life Coach, is The Gay Love Coach: “I work with gay men who are ready to create a road map that will lead them to find and build a lasting partnership with Mr. Right.” To sign up for the FREE Gay Love Coach Newsletter filled with dating and relationship tips and skills for gay singles and couples, as well as to check out current coaching groups, programs, and teleclasses, please visit

~~~~THANKS again to Michael/


Gary Kelly said...

The problem I have with this type of article is that it promotes dependence... that happiness only comes in pairs.

If I had known 40 years ago what I now know about independence, and how to make it work, I could have saved myself a helluva lot of frustration.

JustinO'Shea said...

Gary, does your "independence" equate with "detschment" or "alienation"?. .. maybe "non-involvement"?

Can/do you ever say or feel "I depend on you." ? Meaning?


JustinO'Shea said...

That is supposed to be "detachment". . .;-). . . .. sleepy. . .;-)

Gary Kelly said...

What I'm saying my dear little JustinO is that people who sail solo around the world don't do it because they wanna live the rest of their lives as hermits. They do it to prove they can rely on themselves when the going gets tough... when there's only one person you can count on.

Hillary Clinton in her video about teen suicide and bullying said she wanted those teens to know that they are not alone. To me, that's like saying being alone is a bad thing... something to be avoided.

What I'm saying is that being alone ain't so bad if you're equipped to handle independence and self-reliance.

I think if you're able to survive on your own, then everything else is a bonus. I'm not against happiness coming in pairs, but I would remind people that Mr Wonderful can become Mr Ew one day, hehe. And when that happens you're back solo. If you can handle being solo it's not a biggie.

The danger is believing that you can't be happy by being alone. It's not true. You can.

Nobody loves you when you're down and out. That's not true either. There's always one person who loves you. And that's the most important person you'll ever meet. Know what I mean?

JustinO'Shea said...

Gary, I am do not think you grasp what Hilary Clinton is saying:
"Hillary Clinton in her video about teen suicide and bullying said she wanted those teens to know that they are not alone. To me, that's like saying being alone is a bad thing... something to be avoided."

These gay kids who commit suicide DO feel they are ALL ALONE; that no one else is LIKE THEY ARE; parents, society, other teens treat them as if they were freaks, sick, depraved, etc etc.

First off, you need to get their attention and show them you care, some one else cares,knows what they are going thru. . . has been in the same situation as they are presently in. . .etc.

Why do you think any one of these young people would kill themselves???

This is enough from me on this topic. If you do not see this, then it is pointless for me to say any more,

Ciao, mate!


JustinO'Shea said...

One more word. . or two. . or three. . . I see you meant literally sailing solo around the world. That is not what we are talking about here. . .That is not normative for personal growth. Sailing solo is a terminal event, it is not a 'way of life', a period of adolescent growth which, btw, extends into the late 20s.

And the kind of aloneness and "detachment" is not possible for the majority of adolescents; they do not yet possess the psychic energies to live like that. They haven't lived long enough to acquire/mature into these properties.
[ I am not writing from personal experience now. . .I am still in processmysekf. But I can quote to you what specialists in human growth and interpersonal relationships have learned over the years. .]

We learn and develop the necessary psychic dynamic skills to stand on our own two feet, and later to go it on our own in certain areas from our association and identification with our peers. Where that ID-ing doesn't occur because of non-acceptance. . .because of being queer, a faggot, a homo. . . .where is he going to find support and acceptance from . . unless s/he is told s/he is not alone, there are others just the same, and so forth?

Gary Kelly said...

I'm not disagreeing with you, JustinO, and I'm not criticizing what Hillary said about being alone, except to say I no longer associate being alone with being weak or vulnerable.

If a victim of bullying or any other kind of emotional distress thinks he's a freak because he's alone then he's mistaken.

I've been there: ridiculed, bullied, trampled, made to feel worthless, treated like a freak, and told I should never have been born by my own mother.

I know what's it's like to feel like those kids felt. I know what it's like to be in their shoes. I know what it's like to feel abandoned by everyone... to be suicidal.

As the saying goes, you had to be there. In my case, I dealt with the problem by becoming strong and self reliant. There's not a bully or critic alive who can put a dent in my armor these days.

JustinO'Shea said...

AND, GARY, I am so glad you did! Without you we'd all be poorer.

I gyess it's the words. . .you worked at it, hard, I am sure and it didn't happen over night. . .you grew into it.

I've not forgotten your Mom's words about you being gay. . .what pain! BUT you got the strength to work thru it and grow and hang in there.
Not everyone, sadly, is able to do that!

ciao, Mate. . .


Gary Kelly said...

And yes I do agree that it takes a while to develop the psychic dynamic skills needed to stand on our own two feet.

But ya gotta start somewhere.

Coop said...

Thanks for this Justin. It gives me a lot of guidance.

I will say, publicly, that I'm wrestling with my desires/ view of sexuality and my Catholic faith.
Even though they aren't that far apart.

Stew said...

Your banter here could be summed up by saying that we all want to feel accepted. However, we are stronger by being able to stand alone and have people accept us as an individual.
And I will always promote that everyone needs to be comfortable with themselves before they will ever fit with someone else.

JCinmeforever said...

I side with stew's thought; The 'Dunes' has past article on being a functional (emotionally and otherwise) single before you can be successful in as a 'couple'. Accepting yourself as you are emotionally, Spiritually, sexually with confidence is an important foundation in working toward being the best you can be in any type of relationship...friends or partners.
Happiness, I agree does not only come in pairs...but you can be more fulfilled, inspired and motivated in the idea of 'two''s what I pray for, to be a 'two' someday...but in the meantime, grow in confidence with my independence. 'Seek and you shall find'...

JustinO'Shea said...

Are you sure about this, Stew?
" And I will always promote that everyone needs to be comfortable with themselves before they will ever fit with someone else."

Is it possible that I can "fit with someone else" and thus grow in becoming "comfortable" with myself because this one has accepted me and loved me and so I am better able to love myself and become more comfortable and thus better relate with the one who has assisted me to become more comfortable with myself. . . . PHEW!
Aren't all good relationships doing this dynamic?

If i had to wait to work it out by myself I might never get around having this wonderful rel. . . . .well you get my point. .. ;-))

Are the dynamics of human growth cast in concrete? Naaaawwww. . . ;-)


Gary Kelly said...

It can work that way, JustinO. But you could be waiting a helluva long time to meet the person who assists you to be comfortable with yourself. I was mid 50s before it happened to me.

A stitch in time mate. Are you with me?

JustinO'Shea said...

It does work that way! There have been these kind of people ---and I certainly do not limit this to "lovers' etc -- in my life ALL my 22 years! I do think this is quite common for all of us. . .. it is part n parcel of basic human growth. Without these people we do not survive!

Gary Kelly said...

Go to your room.

JCinmeforever said...

...I would not disagree with your point of view too Justin, is where the Lord has lead you to be and it defines and refines you...but many have not found that opportunity...yet!

I agreed with Stew because I believed for myself that it was important to have acceptance, growth and confidence in emotion, Spiritual, and sexual-(ity) as a foundation before being successful in a relationship. So, I, like Stew, would promote it as an encouragement as well.

JCinmeforever said...

...btw The article posted is "When Sex?..." ...I kind of veered off the topic...

I think that sex can delude and distort and sabotage a potential relationship if engaged too soon.

I particularly have this view when as a Christian man I think of a relationship to be focused on Christ first and the physical will adapt as time is invested.

The physical is, no doubt, an important part of our human make-up. To the idea of when? in the dating process, probably left up to the two individuals engaging. I would not be judgmental toward a view different from mine, but I do believe that I would encourage waiting a bit...till there is at least some knowledge that a relationship might bloom as opposed to a "roll in the hay that walks away".

JustinO'Shea said...

I Y'AM IN MY ROOM ! YOU are the visitor. . .hahahahahah. . . .and welcome. . . .;-)

Anonymous said...

I have to admit, right away, that I have had very little experience thus far with dating and gay relationships. But from what dates I have had, I seem to be working the reverse of this process.

My relationships go something like this; I meet a cool guy who catches my eye. I catch his eye and we play the little dance about "is-he-or-isn't-he." We talk and talk and then one of us suggests being horizontal and naked together, and we go someplace to become so. If the sex was good... then we meet up again, and again, and maybe again. By this time one of us has decided the other guy really isn't the mate we are searching for, and the "relationship" tapers off into just being kind of distant friends, which in itself is not a bad thing.

I wonder if I'm placing too much emphasis on the physical side and not enough on the emotional side? The trouble I have is that I keep falling for the same type of dude... thin, cute, kind of nerdy, and a liberal arts major. After screwing each other senseless, there never seems to be anything we have in common upon which we could build a long-term relationship. Hell, after the sex there really hasn't been much to talk about. I hate Shakespeare and he can't understand the modulus of elasticity. Other than school experiences we never seems to have anything in common. We don't even have mutual friends.

On the other hand, those gay guys who are like me, and with whom I have great friendships haven't come onto my radar as sexual partners. I just got back from a weekend spent rough camping and kayaking with three butch-as-they-make-'em gay dudes and sex hardly ever entered the conversations. I would worry that sex would change or damage those friendships, because sex does change everything once it happens between two guys.

Gary Kelly said...

Banister begins by admiting he has very little experience. Then he goes on to write a comment that is articulate, intelligent and witty.

If he's that smart now, what's he gonna be like after he's stacked up a few more years?

I'm impressed.