Saturday, March 12, 2011

re Older - Younger Relationships

GoodRock has left a new comment on your post "TRUE COLORS -- SAFETY":

I understand that "imbalance of power and authority", but I also know there are a lot of healthy relationships that did in fact begin in just such a situation, primarily between employer-employee and teacher-student.

I don't want to make an argument against any regulations, but is a blanket, rigid policy the only option when dealing with adults?

GOODROCK:  Thanks for raising this issue.  As I think about it, seems to me maybe the TC program rules are restrictive due to the nature of the program and the great variance in ages of participants, which do include some of  middle school age, and up.
I can imagine care be taken not to give anyone grounds to attack the TC program and participants, accusing them using this as facilitating mixing and sexual contact.

Don't you think our society is so uptight on sex things what with the plethora of scandals, accusations real and imaginary, almost somewhat to the status of 'witch hunt'.  Our legal system is such that laws to prevent/ward off sexual contacts between adults and minors. .. .correct me, but isn't everyone under the age of 18 a minor?  

Once an adult is accused - -whether it is true or not -- he is finished!
His name/reputation is ruined; his career is ended.  How often do we hear of people being proven innocent?  Even so, it is rather common to hold "Where there is smoke there is fire."  As someone said in group "Well, I read it in the Boston Globe. . .they wouldn't print it if it weren't true!"  My reply to that. . ..BS !  And quel naivete' !

Let's move the musing beyond professional as in doctor - patient, lawyer - client, teacher - student, etc. . .I think it is possible for two people. . ..two adults of differing age spans. . . .to be in a loving relationship and to enjoy a happy life together. . . .if they can withstand the questioning raising of eyebrows, or that 'knowing' eye movement of insinuation. . . etc.

Isn't one of  the problems we have to deal with and overcome the fact of two consenting adults being in a same-sex relationship?  A lot of areas in our society do not approve.  The fact that it is necessary to make laws to prevent hate crimes    ""and discrimination is ample reminder  that we do have an uphill journey.

I hope those of you who have experience, thoughts and ideas about the question Rock raises will take some time to share your experience, strength and hope so we "youngsters"...ahem. . . .can learn from you guys.   Thanks very much.



Stew said...

Of the few may/december relationships that I know of, it's been the younger person that initiated the courtship and even controlled the relationship after it was up and running. Speaking from experience, it's nice to have the attention of a younger person. To feel that you still have something to offer someone younger than you.
Having said that and admitting to something more than I should, I would not recommend such a relationship. A relationship should be between equals. It doesn't matter if the younger or older person is more dominate. There should not be anyone that is in charge of anyone else. I think what this policy is against is such a thing. Where someone has power over someone and can easily use it against them or for a personal gain (whatever that might be).
Especially where middle school kids are involved, I commend this group for installing such a rule.

JustinO'Shea said...

Hey there...good morning. I am just beginning to 'circulate'..;-) Stew, your comment is just the kind I was hoping for. THANKS!

So you are saying "A relationship is between equals. ." And you wouldn't recommend a May-December one. Correctamente? ;-)

OK, would you care to expand a bit more on the why-nots? Control/ownership seems to be an issue. "No one should be in control" Ownership. . . hmmmmm. .

You got the floor. . . .;-)


Gary Kelly said...

I agree with Stew - it is nice to have a relationship with a younger person; to feel that you still have something to offer. But I believe that 'something' should not involve sex.

Sex was introduced by Nature for one purpose, and one purpose only. When it's used for other purposes in a relationship, the territory becomes fraught with danger.

There are those who will disagree with me, of course. Who will argue that sex is an expression of love and affection. Maybe it is, but in many circumstances it is inappropriate.

Some people believe that cows were put on this earth so that we humans can enjoy ice cream and McDonalds. Well, I disagree. Just because ice cream and McDonalds exist, doesn't mean that's the reason cows do.

And it's the same with sex. Just because sex is used for purposes other than originally intended, is that a valid reason to assume that's why it exists?

JustinO'Shea said...

GARY, interesting. You do know, correct? , that what you posit in your clear statement is the actual teaching of the Catholic Church. . .

"You can take the boy out of the country. . . . . ."

Thanks, Gary.


Gary Kelly said...

Go to your room.

JustinO'Shea said...

YES, sir. . . .on my way. . . .;-)

J said...

Gary for Pope.

Anonymous said...

Mr Kelly,
Yes, I agree with you.
It is possible to ahve a good and meaningful relationship with those younger than oneself, without sex.

I have a lot of close and very good friends who are quite a bit younger than I. All are "straight" whatever that means....some are quite straight....or they are very "lightly gay", ie don't quite admit it to themselves.

But whatever, quite a few of them know, and some of them have guessed and some are quite oblivious as to my sexuality. (I like the mystery that surrounds me..hee hee)

However, some of are very close, a couple of them are comfortable enough when I, at some brilliantly fun and poignantly appropriate moment (no, not sex) have said that I love them ...and a few times I've had some of them say the same thing. We are on the same page. It is possible to really love other human beings without sex....very close to sex indeed, there can be physical contact, but not sexual.

It works for me...and them, surprisingly enough. Not all straights are painted with the same brush...gays either, so it seems, ha!

Sure, there are times when you ahve that internal fight with yourself, NOT to take things further as you know you might risk losing that wonderful relationship for the sake of physical satiation and euphoria, and I've been thre, done that. Sometimes things are ok after, but always it is different, not always good. But we live and learn...hopefully. Keep it platonic is the safe way, safe platonic sex...not always tho.,.....there is always "that chance"...haha...what an oxymoron I am!

It's funny how some "outsiders" see me and my younger friends and you can tell sometimes when and what they are thinking....I used to hate it....but now it somewhat titilates me ... the only downside is what my younger friends might be "tainted" with by hanging around with me. But then no-one "knows" who/what I really am, apart from friends so who cares.

Being out isn't everything.
Sex isn't everything (close tho) but life is good. I LOVE my friends....and I know they love me, even if they can't all voice it.

Like I say, life is good and being old(er) isn't all that bad. (Just as well, there's only one option there, haha!)

Greg in sunny warm spring-like Adelaide

(I do love our early autumns, here in Oz in some parts of the country we get a kind of spring as winter approaches, flowers, green, Mediterranean weather, n-i-i-i-ce)

Coop said...

I agree with Justin on this. 100%.
I also think GoodRock is jumping to a conclusion "meaningful relationship must equal sex."

JustinO'Shea said...

COOPsta. . ..I didnt see ROCK saying anything like that at all. . .in fact he didn't. . . ..unless you receive a different version.

Have you had your Starbucks yet? Or do your glasses need cleaning from the fog of the North Shore? Sun out yet?

Do you watch NCIS? Here..for you. . ..whack!. . .like Jethro does to Dennozzo! LOL

Anonymous said...

Oh shit Justin, you do crack me up every now and then.....

"Here..for you. . ..whack!. . .like Jethro does to Dennozzo! LOL"

That mental picture might not make some people laugh as much as it does for us...but hey, their

Luv ya mate,

Coop said...

That's right. GoodRock DIDN'T say anything like that.
Now I get it.

I'm not yet 30 but I remember what I was like at 18/19. All the emotions, teenage anxiety not quite gone, etc. Someone like that might drive me crazy. But a dude of 18ish who is more mature... ???
I guess age just isn't high on my list. I honestly don't know how I feel about older/younger relationships.