Wednesday, February 3, 2010

Military says lift ban on gays

Defense officials say lift military ban on gays (AP) [[click for full report ]]

AP - It's time to repeal the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy and allow gay troops to serve openly for the first time in history, the nation's top defense officials declared Tuesday, with the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff proclaiming that service members should not be forced to "lie about who they are."


Stew said...

I know how rediculous DADT is. Keep in mind that it had it's place in time. There was a time when they did ask. At least that stoppped. I think that everyone knows that it's time for it to end though.

Jack Greenman said...

As someone who tried to enlist in the Navy twice, and was in ROTC Air Force for a very short time.. This pleases me immensely.

A guy I knew from a gay forum was booted out of the Navy for being gay - and I mean the Navy was his life.

That said I think the rumored shortage of troops may have been part of it (I'm cynical), and besides that, there are rights here in the states that gays don't have yet depending on where you are.

I think its sort of funny that the Gov has decided that its OK for gays to fight for our Rights and Freedoms, when we are sort of lacking in that department still.

JustinO'Shea said...

You're cynical? Hear this: "Sure, let those f*^king gays into the service and send them to Iraq & Afghanistan. They might as well get killed as our boys!!!"

"As our boys"? These f-ing gays are somebody's boys. Stupid rednecks! Dumber than hell. . .

They say str8 guys our age [18-34] don't have much problem with gays. The top brass general yesterday said that, AND that he had worked with gays in service all his military career.

At that John McCain went ballistic, with his beady little pig eyes, and his jaw wattles shaking. . .what IS his problem?

Jack, too bad they don't consult us! LOL We'd fix 'em good. hahaaaaaa


Jack Greenman said...

Hahahahaha I'm cynical and they're bigots - what a wonderful world we live in! Bigot fits right? I can't remember if thats more for race and religion... Screw it! It fits!

Well the top brass got it right, in a sort of old fashioned outlook kind of way.

At the motorcycle mechanics school I attended for a while I had this one class where my partner for a project was an honest to god Nazi. The eagle tattooed to his throat and swastika on his chest. Scary fellow. Anyways! One night he went off on a F@g tangent about how gays are no better than women (my mother by the way could kick his ass) and ranted and raved about limp wrists and all the stereotypes.

I'd re-closeted myself when I moved to Phoenix because I didn't know who I was going to meet, and the only difference between my being in the closet and out is I actually have to tell people, as I don't fit any stereotypes. So I just let this guy talk - and had a silent chuckle because I was better at working on the engine than he was - and can out do a hell of a lot of straights when it comes to working with my hands on machines and houses.

I fear McCain has the views of my Nazi friend.

It's our Generation Justin that's going to change the world. The gays in their 40s (and up, dear old Gary) laid the foundation, now we just have to build it up.


JustinO'Shea said...

Jack, not in my wildest could I imagine a tatto on my throat and esp not a swastika on my chest!!!

Once I did have a "tat" on my left shoulder. . .a henna tat. . painted on. . .lasts about a month. After the novelty wore off I was convinced skin-signs were not my thing. I tried to help the henna tat in the shower by extra soaping. . .hhee. . it went in a month. Never again -- neither for love nor money! ;-)

Trust me! hahahaaa

Jack Greenman said...

Haha ya, I knew a few guys in Phoenix with throat tattoos - god the pain tolerances, not people to pick a fight with - not that I'd ever pick a fight *looks innocent* And yes, I agree with the Swastika... never had a tolerance with Hate. But on the other hand I am apparently likable enough where the Nazi wanted to be my friend... how ironic.

No tats for you? I bet you Lava Soap would have gotten it off =p I have 2 at the moment, my best friend in Phoenix was a tattoo artist, and mine were free - the one on my chest HURT mainly because I have no meat on my bones, so.. that and when it was close to the collar bones - amazing how sensitive that area is.

I'll end up with a few more before my time is up, but I'll never be the guy who has so many you can't see skin, nor will they ever be visible when I wear a t-shirt. They also all have to MEAN something to me. But I digress, I hated tats till I moved to Phoenix and befriended a tattoo artist. Life is funny.

J said...

There've been gays in the military since the beginning of time, eons before the time of the gayest of them all, Alexander the Great. Regrettably our Judeo-christian tradition is less forgiving of diverse sexual preferences that was that of pagan societies.The real problem for us is the same one that afflicts the inclusion of women in the service--fraternization. These changes can work only if the anti-fraternization rule is strictly adhered to, and that sexual harassment of any sort is dealt with harshly. Displays of affection while on duty should also be strictly forbidden. If we're to get over this cultural adjustment we must adopt this posture to avoid creating resentment and having the whole thing backfire.
I really think you're being a bit harsh on McCain, Justin. He was brought up in a different era, as part of a longstanding naval familial tradition. He is not a demagogue. It is more than probable that he actually believes a gay presence in close quarters will be disruptive of military cohesion and discipline. The question is whether or not the average recruit is beyond the cultural homophobia that so afflicted society until recent times. Field commanders are acutely aware of extraneous tensions in the ranks, because they distract everyone from the military mission.
As for John McCain personally, he has paid his dues many times over. He was tortured unmercifully by the North Vietnamese because his father was Supreme Commander of the Pacific, and yet he refused their offer to let him out of prison early because he didn't want special treatment. In the Senate he has been one of the few Republicans who has been willing to reach across the isle to guys like Russ Feingold and the late Ted Kennedy to make bipartisan deals. I think you should cut him some slack.
And as for Obama, don't count your chickens before they're hatched. He hasn't delivered anything but high quality bullshit since he took office, and by next fall's elections he will have completely squandered his legislative advantage. He's still entertaining massive spending even when China is squeezing us like a fat tick on a hound's ear.I'm afraid we won't get even the very necessary banking reform Paul Volker is seeking, which is designed the forestall another meltdown of our overfinancialized economy. As the latest New Yorker cover illustrates, Obama is no water walker. He's now being compared to Jimmy Carter, and that can't be good news for any president.

Gary Kelly said...

Jack's comments are making me feel redundant. I don't understand what happened. It's only a couple of years ago that I was smarter than him.

Jack Greenman said...

You were too good of a teacher Gary... way too good of a teacher =p

Gary Kelly said...

If there's another side to the coin, trust J to polish it up and make it shine.

Gary Kelly said...

Yes, me again. A mate of mine wants to know if the Don't Ask, Don't Tell policy was ever imposed on black and colored people in the military.


JustinO'Shea said...

They didnt have to tell cuz no one asked them!

Stew said...

But if you did tell, without them asking.....

Coop said...

DADT should be repealed. And quick.
Midterm elections are coming up and the Democrats stand to lose the advantage.
Although, if top military officials want to end DADT, I think the Republicans will play along. The Republicans don't seem to argue with the military. Or am I thinking wishfully?

I like what J has to say about McCain. President Obama and his administration are more welcoming and supportive than Bush.

The President seems to be "all talk and no action" on initiatives for GLBT equality. Many in the GLBT community are unhappy. With the new focus on DADT, I feel that promises are now last minute efforts. It's almost a disappointment. Why 'last minute'? I'm 99.9% certain that the democrats in congress will lose horse power (mule power?) in the fall elections.

I'm not ready to say that there's a rise in "anti-equality/" "anti-Gay" sentiment. I think voters are turning away from the Democrats for other reasons.

Try telling that to the politicians. They won't listen. The Republicans won't say "Oh. Okay. Voters Don't like (X), (A), and (B). The voters DO tolerate Gay people." Nope. The Republicans will use the new influence for whatever they please.

See... this is what happens when you don't drink the political party punch. LOL!


Stew said...

The thing that republican's have going for them is that no matter what stupid idea they have, they all move together. If one get's up and says, let's go walk off the end of the pier, they will all go.
Democrats on the other hand, all have thier own ideas and can't seem to get together on anything. Rusulting in nothing getting done.

I think the whole country is getting frustrated.

Gary Kelly said...

Stew makes a very valid point there... no cohesion, no grip. Until all members of a political party think like team players, with a common goal, the team can kiss itself goodbye.

Coop said...

Here is the link to the Bay Windows story on Pres. Obama's state of the Union. He isn't getting a glowing review from the Gay community that's fer sure.

B.W. is the Boston GLBT paper. The paper copy comes out once a week. That's the version I read.